Songs That Wouldn't Have Made the Cut
Songs That Wouldn't Have Made the Cut
#0Songs That Wouldn't Have Made the Cut
Posted: 6/2/04 at 12:01pm
I've been discussing among friends the notion that 'all songs in a musical must further the plot' (something I don't inherently believe to be true.) I then said 'look if only songs that further the plot are going to be in musicals we'd better cut 'The Sound of Music' from 'The Sound of Music.'
So, I'm curious: can we think of other classic showtunes that would NOT make it if the only thing songs do is 'further the plot?'
Borstalboy
Broadway Legend Joined: 2/9/04
#1re: Songs That Wouldn't Have Made the Cut
Posted: 6/2/04 at 12:07pmYou'd have to include just about every Jerry Herman number....
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Matt_G
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/1/04
#2re: Songs That Wouldn't Have Made the Cut
Posted: 6/2/04 at 12:12pmHmmm. MEIN HERR doesn't really further the plot of CABARET and it's one of my favorites from the show.
"Noah, someday we'll talk again. But there's things we'll never say. That sorrow deep inside you. It inside me, too. And it never go away. You be okay. You'll learn how to lose things..."
#3Mein Herr
Posted: 6/2/04 at 12:29pm
Although Mein Herr doesn't exactly further the plot, the way it was used in the recent revival provides character development -- and that's part of the plot.
The song comes right after Sally has a break-up, and although she sings the song as part of a performance it still provides insight to her attitude toward relationships.
robbiej
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/20/03
SueleenGay
Broadway Legend Joined: 6/9/03
leomaxfrank
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robbiej
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/20/03
MusicMan
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/16/03
#9Mein Herr
Posted: 6/2/04 at 3:44pm
The musical form is elastic enough to accommodate songs that not only further the plot or reveal character but also allow for moments of repose, demonstration of performers' virtuosity, production numbers, etc. The over-psychologizing of the dramatic musical at the expense of fantasy, romance, and humor has brought the form to an artistic dead end and certainly accounts for the rash of musical comedies that have surfaced in the last few years.
GovernorSlaton
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/14/04
#11Mein Herr
Posted: 6/2/04 at 5:43pm
Absolutely, GovernorSlaton. I think "Wicked"'s score just gets in the way of the plot.
As for songs that don't advance plots, "Ya Never Know" from LSOH doesn't really do anything. Neither do any of Muzzy's songs in TMM, but they are very pretty, even if they don't serve any real porpose.
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JakeB
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/15/03
#12Mein Herr
Posted: 6/2/04 at 5:49pmWhat?! Hundreds of songs don't do anything for the plot in any tiny little way. They tell you about the character, which yes is character devlopment and possibly plot development, but 50% of the time they are just there for padding and not plot; The Music of the Night, eg.
#13Mein Herr
Posted: 6/2/04 at 5:57pm
Yeah, I could have done without Muzzy's songs. Good songs, yes, but I usually skip right over them. And the show wouldn't have collapsed if they were gone.
And I wouldn't shed one tear if "One Short Day" was cut from WICKED. It's the most pointless and annoying song in the world.
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#17Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/2/04 at 7:42pm
"The Sound of Music" and "Little Lamb" are incredibly essential of furthering the plot to their shows and characters. In "The Sound of Music", we meet Maria, and we get to see into her world, and where she's coming from, and how in love she is with the hills and mountains, and how absent-minded and good natured she is. It gives us so much needed information about her character.
The same can be said about "Little Lamb". We see that Louise doesn't even know how old she is, just furthering how much we know about Rose, and we see how incredibly alone she is. Each of these songs lets us into the character's personal lives; they are quite important.
#18Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/2/04 at 7:43pmCats?
BSoBW2: I punched Sondheim in the face after I saw Wicked and said, "Why couldn't you write like that!?"
Jon
Broadway Legend Joined: 2/20/04
#19Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/2/04 at 11:38pmNonew of the songs in CATS can further the plot becuase CATS has no plot. It's the perfect show for foreign tourists - the lyrics make no sense anyway.
#20Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/3/04 at 12:15am
All right, I'll agree that CATS has the bare minumum in a plot, but what do you mean by "the lyrics make no sense"? Is that in connection to the story or are they just unintelligeble?
Anyway, before I go off on a tangent, back to the topic at hand. Two more songs I would add to the list are "Two Ladies" and "You'll Never Walk Alone."
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#21Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/3/04 at 12:38amHmm I'd say "Seasons of Love" doesn't really do anything to push the Rent plot along. But Im not a Rent fan so I don't know if this point is really valid.
And hang on, when did you win the discus?
Peter
Leading Actor Joined: 5/28/03
#22Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/3/04 at 1:29amDare I say "Somewhere" from West Side Story?..one of my favorites. It's really a pretty generic love song which certainly does serve a plot point in WSS to a certain extent, but if you take the word "forgiving" out of it, you could pretty easily insert it into any musical with a central love story.
#23Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/3/04 at 4:20amI agree, Peter. Especially when the "dream ballet" sequence is included... a neat plot device and pretty music, sure. But it doesn't necessarily advance the plot. By contrast, every other song in WSS serves an obvious purpose, respectively. "Somewhere" is just a pretty song, though. :)
twogaab2
Broadway Star Joined: 5/19/03
#24Hmmmm.....
Posted: 6/3/04 at 9:43am
Not ALL songs need advance the plot. Lehman Engle's book on American Musical Theater dicusses all of this at length with excellent examples given for each catagory.
I would suggest reading this book as essential.
Just my opinion, I may be wrong.
TWOGAAB
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