Evita white washing controversy?- Page 2
Evita white washing controversy?
rattleNwoolypenguin
Broadway Star Joined: 10/11/11
#25Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:00am
And also the statement of "Since Eva Peron in not latino in traditional sense" we should of course give the role to a White American woman.
How does that not SOUND bad?
#26Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:01am
rattleNwoolypenguin said: "You wouldn't cast white people as Seaweed or Motormouth in Hairspray.
You wouldn't cast white people in Pacific Overtures.
Latinos get cast as white people all the time cause they can "pass for it"
That point is INCREDIBLY VALID. And it's especially valid in this case.
If you wanna fight that, it says something about you."
Those points are not valid comparisons. Seaweed and Motormouth will always be black. Pacific Overtures is a specifically Asian show. You seem to be forgetting that Eva Peron, the real person, was white. You seem to be equating white to American, which is a big red flag. She was Hispanic, that was her ethnicity. But she is majority white by today's standards. Does that make her any less Latino? No, but don't get upset when Eva is cast as a white women because that's how she actually was. As a Latina, I'm not offended by this in the least.
GeorgeandDot
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/13/16
#27Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:06am
Eva's nationality was Argentinian or Latin, but her race was white.
Updated On: 9/14/17 at 12:06 AM
rattleNwoolypenguin
Broadway Star Joined: 10/11/11
#28Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:10am
You're still not making a strong enough argument to go against giving an opportunity for a POC or latina to play this role.
There are blonde latinas. There are South American actresses. They cast one as her in the revival.
#29Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:11am
.....
"You can't overrate Bernadette Peters. She is such a genius. There's a moment in "Too Many Mornings" and Bernadette doing 'I wore green the last time' - It's a voice that is just already given up - it is so sorrowful. Tragic. You can see from that moment the show is going to be headed into such dark territory and it hinges on this tiny throwaway moment of the voice." - Ben Brantley (2022)
"Bernadette's whole, stunning performance [as Rose in Gypsy] galvanized the actors capable of letting loose with her. Bernadette's Rose did take its rightful place, but too late, and unseen by too many who should have seen it" Arthur Laurents (2009)
"Sondheim's own favorite star performances? [Bernadette] Peters in ''Sunday in the Park,'' Lansbury in ''Sweeney Todd'' and ''obviously, Ethel was thrilling in 'Gypsy.'' Nytimes, 2000
Updated On: 6/3/20 at 12:11 AM
GeorgeandDot
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/13/16
#30Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:11am
Eva wasn't a PoC. She was white. That's the argument.
Look, we weren't in the audition room. Maybe this woman earned the part. Maybe she deserves it.
rattleNwoolypenguin
Broadway Star Joined: 10/11/11
#31Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:14am
Also, the response from the director to the backlash was
"Race doesn't play a part in the story so the actors don't have to be latina"
http://www.playbill.com/article/north-shore-exec-responds-to-evita-whitewashing-accusations-says-race-is-not-part-of-the-narrative
If that's the case that "race doesn't play a part in the story", cast a Black Evita or an Asian Evita, or an Asian Che etc.
But to them "race not playing a part" means they can whitewash the whole thing.
#32Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:17am
rattleNwoolypenguin said: "And also the statement of "Since Eva Peron in not latino in traditional sense" we should of course give the role to a White American woman.
How does that not SOUND bad?
"
No one is sayig that....we are saying that Evita is a role that should be able to be able to easily colorblind cast with no backlash, as should the entire show. The show should not be held to the same standard as shows were race is actually an important aspect of the plot Hairspray, Dreamgirls, In the Heights, or Porgy and Bess. But we are also pointing out that Evita, Juan, and Che would all be caucasian according to the US census. Therefore any backlash against casting white actors who are more talented then latino actors in the leads should be a moot point as it makes no sense.
#33Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:22am
rattleNwoolypenguin said: "Also, the response from the director to the backlash was
"Race doesn't play a part in the story so the actors don't have to be latina"
http://www.playbill.com/article/north-shore-exec-responds-to-evita-whitewashing-accusations-says-race-is-not-part-of-the-narrative
If that's the case that "race doesn't play a part in the story", cast a Black Evita or an Asian Evita, or an Asian Che etc.
But to them "race not playing a part" means they can whitewash the whole thing."
EVITA WAS WHITE!!! THERE IS NO WHITEWASHING!!!
Also, there are thousands of stage productions around the country every year. Does every single one of them have to "give an opportunity for a POC"? Even if they don't give the best audition? You are ridiculous.
#34Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:24am
GeorgeandDot said: "Eva's ethnicity was Argentinian or Latin, but her race was white."
Her ethnicity was Basque. Her nationality was Argentinian.
GeorgeandDot
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/13/16
#35Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:28am
hork said: "GeorgeandDot said: "Eva's ethnicity was Argentinian or Latin, but her race was white."
Her ethnicity was Basque. Her nationality was Argentinian."
Thank you, I'll fix my post.
rattleNwoolypenguin
Broadway Star Joined: 10/11/11
#36Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:29am
In a show where the director is claiming "Race doesn't play a part in the story" you don't think it's wrong that he didn't try to create a diverse cast?
Are we just all on this board ignoring the struggles other races and ethnicities find in casting these days?
Have you ever even thought of the fact that a British man who's not even connected to the culture of the story wrote it and set the precedent by casting only white American people?
rattleNwoolypenguin
Broadway Star Joined: 10/11/11
#37Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:33am
Also, there are thousands of stage productions around the country every year. Does every single one of them have to "give an opportunity for a POC"? Even if they don't give the best audition? You are ridiculous.
Yikes. Yes. Yes we do have to give an opportunity for PoC.
Especially if they cast people who are Broadway draws and there are many many Broadway Equity talent that are Latino and PoC
#38Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:36am
rattleNwoolypenguin said: "In a show where the director is claiming "Race doesn't play a part in the story"you don't think it's wrong that he didn't try to create a diverse cast?
Are we just all on this board ignoring the struggles other races and ethnicities find in casting these days?
Have you ever even thought of the fact that a British man who's not even connected to the culture of the story wrote it and set the precedent by casting only white American people?
"
No I am thinking Constantine Marulis can sell tickets, the show rests on Evita's shoulders and if she can't hit the notes the production is doomed, and Cudia understudied Juan on Broadway......
the last thing that would come to my mind when casting such a difficult show as Evita, would be let me find a token role to cast a POC.
GeorgeandDot
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/13/16
#39Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:39am
Hopefully PoC were taken into consideration just as seriously as the white actors. They most likely were. The roles went to who they felt could do the best work and those performers just happened to be white. I'm certain that if a latina had given the better audition she would have received the part.
ScottyDoesn'tKnow2
Broadway Legend Joined: 1/22/14
#40Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 12:59am
I swear, is this forum just a place where people can express disgust about topics of race from a mostly anti-social justice perspective? I mean a thread now and again seems normal, but it seems like every other day it's just the same people expressing disgust about POC of some sort. I get that people can be annoying and misguided some times, but I feel like that's all some posters like talking about around here. Some times it feels like I stepped into a Fox News comments section.
rattleNwoolypenguin
Broadway Star Joined: 10/11/11
#41Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:02am
I swear, is this forum just a place where people can express disgust about topics of race from a mostly anti-social justice perspective? I mean a thread now and again seems normal, but it seems like every other day it's just the same people expressing disgust about POC of some sort. I get that people can be annoying and misguided some times, but I feel like that's all some posters like talking about around here. Some times it feels like I stepped into a Fox News comments section.
Seriously. The level of defensiveness wigged me out tonight. Theatre peeps should be better than that.
#42Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:02am
Exactly. These right-wing bigots need to understand that until 100% of white roles go to 0% of white people there is never going to be diversity or fairness for POC. I'm tired of the racism and bigotry and hate on this forum.
"You can't overrate Bernadette Peters. She is such a genius. There's a moment in "Too Many Mornings" and Bernadette doing 'I wore green the last time' - It's a voice that is just already given up - it is so sorrowful. Tragic. You can see from that moment the show is going to be headed into such dark territory and it hinges on this tiny throwaway moment of the voice." - Ben Brantley (2022)
"Bernadette's whole, stunning performance [as Rose in Gypsy] galvanized the actors capable of letting loose with her. Bernadette's Rose did take its rightful place, but too late, and unseen by too many who should have seen it" Arthur Laurents (2009)
"Sondheim's own favorite star performances? [Bernadette] Peters in ''Sunday in the Park,'' Lansbury in ''Sweeney Todd'' and ''obviously, Ethel was thrilling in 'Gypsy.'' Nytimes, 2000
rattleNwoolypenguin
Broadway Star Joined: 10/11/11
#43Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:08am
Exactly. These right-wing bigots need to understand that until 100% of white roles go to 0% of white people there is never going to be diversity or fairness for POC. I'm tired of the racism and bigotry and hate on this forum.
Again...white people using sarcasm defensively.
Let's be better guys. I'm washing my hands of this topic.
#44Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:08am
qolbinau said: "Exactly. These right-wing bigots need to understand that until 100% of white roles go to 0% of white people there is never going to be diversity or fairness for POC. I'm tired of the racism and bigotry and hate on this forum."
Right. Because most of those talented and deserving performers who ace their auditons happen to be of Caucasian heritage.
#45Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:18am
Me? Sarcastic? No I'm genuinely outraged that a white woman is playing a historical figure who is a white woman. Next they are going to cast Lady Gaga in the lead role of The Color Purple I can just feel it. And feel very deeply I do because my emotions cloud my reasoning ability.
"You can't overrate Bernadette Peters. She is such a genius. There's a moment in "Too Many Mornings" and Bernadette doing 'I wore green the last time' - It's a voice that is just already given up - it is so sorrowful. Tragic. You can see from that moment the show is going to be headed into such dark territory and it hinges on this tiny throwaway moment of the voice." - Ben Brantley (2022)
"Bernadette's whole, stunning performance [as Rose in Gypsy] galvanized the actors capable of letting loose with her. Bernadette's Rose did take its rightful place, but too late, and unseen by too many who should have seen it" Arthur Laurents (2009)
"Sondheim's own favorite star performances? [Bernadette] Peters in ''Sunday in the Park,'' Lansbury in ''Sweeney Todd'' and ''obviously, Ethel was thrilling in 'Gypsy.'' Nytimes, 2000
GeorgeandDot
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/13/16
BroadwayRox3588
Broadway Legend Joined: 10/5/16
#47Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:20am
I swear, some people will not be satisfied until the casting table becomes one big charity or PSA.
ScottyDoesn'tKnow2
Broadway Legend Joined: 1/22/14
#48Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:22am
qolbinau said: "Exactly. These right-wing bigots need to understand that until 100% of white roles go to 0% of white people there is never going to be diversity or fairness for POC. I'm tired of the racism and bigotry and hate on this forum."
I think this post is very illustrative of how this forum is being perceived by outsiders and the low level of nuance, sophistication, and understanding displayed with any discussion about race here, even if people may have a legitimate point such as Eva Person being a white person so casting a woman of the same complexion makes sense. I feel like I know why the image-conscious are mods erasing posts and deleting threads these days.
Also, I agree with others that actors don't have to have the same exact life experience in order to empathize and play the part well...but even thinking that I think it'd be great if we at least try to have a real discussion as opposed to the usual ranting and raving and going off the rails about "SJWs" or other popular buzz words by the same people who are just doing it to antagonize those who think whitewashing is more than just about skin color but culture and ethnicity (and there are white latinx people). Also try to understand the fact that because this has historically almost always happened, it may make people think of outsiders mimicking accents and adopting stereotypical attitudes about how certain people act. It's sort of similar to how many Italian-Americans make a big deal about Italian stereotypes on movies and tv shows and why casting directors attempt to cast as many actors of Italian-descent as possible these days.
Rather, some of the actual posts that always pop up in these race-related threads and the volume, vigor, and intensity of such posts just reveal a real anger and bitterness about any discussion of race beyond casting and the attitudes displayed are being pretty transparent and a bit unnerving. It's all couched in being angry people being illogical, but they're not the only ones who are being that way and allowing their anger and irrationality dictate the tone and content of their posts when these discussions happen.
RippedMan
Broadway Legend Joined: 8/14/05
#49Evita white washing controversy?
Posted: 9/14/17 at 1:27am
Here's my thing, as an actor, and I get that race is an "iffy" subject. But, if you're saying that someone from Spain or Puerto Rico is a better choice to play Evita, then I'm confused. I mean, look at something like Fiddler on the Roof. So we're only allowed to have born, raised Jewish people in the part? I mean actors are actors. I'd hate to see the day when we're only allowed to play our specific struggles in life.
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